UAV strike platoon commander Leila: "There are no cyborgs or creatures made of titanium here. Everyone is just flesh-and-blood human being. Soldiers need to be given time to rest"
Leila, call sign Saracen, is a platoon commander of the strike UAVs of the K-2 battalion of the 54th SMB. Since the beginning of the Russian-Ukrainian war in 2014, she has been a volunteer, helping her friends and acquaintances in the military. Before the full-scale invasion, she worked in the IT industry. After the Russian attack on February 24, 2022, she went to the military registration and enlistment office, but was denied for the first time.
- You tried to join the army nine times. Why were you not accepted?
- There were different reasons. At first, they explained that there were enough people, so they didn't take girls. Later, when I tried to join specific units, either the position was not relevant or they took a long time to process my documents, but in the end, it ended up with nothing.
- You joined K-2 through an acquaintance, so you came with a letter of request. Isn't that right?
- That's exactly right. A pilot I knew vouched for me. I applied in August 2022. I had an interview. At the end of the month, I came to the unit.
- At first, you flew Mavics. Then there were FPVs. Then - bombers. Why were they chosen for work?
- It was the next step - development. Then we started using FPVs. And we had another large attack drone in the battalion that no one had flown. I was offered to try it.
- Did you like it the most?
- In principle, I like all drones. I flew Mavics, a reconnaissance fixed-wing UAV, and learned FPV. When I saw a large strike drone in operation, I realized that it could not only conduct reconnaissance but also be an effective weapon. This appealed to me more than being just an aerial reconnaissance specialist.
- What are the peculiarities of flying bombers? The same Mavic, obviously, is easier.
- Yes, it is. It is a base. It is difficult to start flying any other aircraft if you have not had any experience of flying a Mavic before. It can be compared to secondary education: you learn how to fly a UAV, respond to weather conditions, understand the operational situation and navigate the terrain. "Mavic's are really the eyes of the army.
And large sides require, firstly, planning, intelligence data, and target confirmation. Secondly, the choice of position. Because they are massive, visible and heavy. Speaking of control, they are controlled by a joystick, roughly speaking, like a Mavic. The only thing is that they are heavy, inertial, and fly with ammunition. In order for a combat mission to be successful, you have to calculate and take into account its weight, altitude, and wind.
- I was reminded of a statement made by Oleksii Reznikov two years ago, when he was still the Minister of Defence, that Mavic drones are wedding drones...
- Many people from our military leadership, if they could fight as people riding on horses with drawn swords, would do so. Because it is massive and epic. But we don't have to do that! Compared to the enemy's army, we actually have very few people, and drones cover many needs. It doesn't matter if they are wedding drones or not. Drones, as I said, are eyes. They see what the infantry cannot see. They eliminate the need to walk on foot and conduct reconnaissance. In addition, it is a very cool and effective strike tool for destroying enemy equipment and manpower.
The UAV industry began to develop rapidly due to the lack of aviation, insufficient artillery, and a shortage of ammunition. Additionally, drones are a ‘risk-free weapon,’ and they have now become an independent field. When it comes to strike drones specifically, they don’t replace artillery but rather enhance the weaponry available to a unit or battalion.
- The enemy is also actively developing this industry and making a significant bet on it. You can see that, right?
- Absolutely! At the beginning of the full-scale invasion, the enemy had an advantage in UAVs, including reconnaissance fixed-wing and strike drones. They had "Orlans", kamikazes, then FPVs, etc. This is mass production - they are made in very large quantities.
- According to the president, we were supposed to have a million drones this year. There are two months left to the end, but we don't see them...
- It seems to me that it is wrong to operate with specific numbers, like we will give the military a million drones. We need to understand that we have a sustainable production facility that can provide the Armed Forces with reconnaissance fixed-wing UAVs, attack drones and ammunition on a regular basis.
- Speaking of production. In one of his interviews,your battalion commander Kyrylo Veres said that sometimes "flying stools" - low-quality drones - get to the front . I take it you have had to deal with such things in your work?
- Of course, because the criticism voiced by the battalion commander is based on the experience of our unit. Look, when it comes to the number of drones under contract with the Ministry of Defense, there are about 30 units of large strike bombers. Of these, five are actually flying. As for the rest, in fact, many drones arrive that cannot be used in combat conditions. They are combat-ineffective! I wonder how the procurement process works in our country, what people are involved when a drone is tested and awarded a contract! In the third year of the full-scale invasion, when there are already effective units, it is possible to conduct combat testing, collect feedback from these pilots, take into account criticism in production and improve the means. Instead, certain manufacturers say: "No, we did it this way. We have this vision." There can be no such vision! This is a weapon that either works or it doesn't! You can voice your vision to your friends in the kitchen. But when you are making weapons, you cannot produce a mortar that does not fire and give it to the army for a contract with the words: "This is how I see it!"
- What do you do with such drones? Do you have to recycle them? How do you get out of the situation?
- We recycle some of them. The rest are in warehouses because we cannot use them when the manufacturer refuses to change them. And with a small unit in a mechanized battalion, we cannot sit around and rework mass production. I have a combat job to do. First of all, I have to plan for my crews to fulfill their role in combat. We cannot continue to work for production that covers the needs of the MOD. The defense industry must give me the means of destruction so that my unit can go and destroy the enemy. Not vice versa, so that we work for them. As long as I am at the front in combat, I am fighting. I have to do it with effective weapons.
- It's a shame that you have to face this kind of thing...
- You know, I am against forced mobilization, pulling people from the street and forcing them into a van - packing people. But I really want the engineers of the combat-ineffective aircraft, who were gathered in an unknown way, to be mobilized to my unit, and they would work on the equipment they themselves have engineered with their own vision. It seems to me that they will get it faster that way.
- We are talking to you just after the TCR and the police raided restaurants and nightclubs in big cities like Kyiv, Kharkiv, and Dnipro. They also checked men of military age after the Okean Elzy concert. Some were forced into cars. As a commander, is it more difficult for you to deal with those who were mobilized against their will than with those who came voluntarily?
- We have different people in our battalion. Some were pulled from the street and forced into a van, others came on their own. In my unit, there are only a few contract soldiers. The rest are mobilized. In fact, it doesn't matter what the motivation is. He has already come, he did not run away from the van or pay off. I am already grateful to him for being here. My task is to teach him, motivate him, and keep him safe, regardless of how he came to me.
- In an interview, you said that large drones can even carry a person weighing up to 60 kilograms. It would be possible to evacuate some of the wounded, but it is dangerous...
- We have a drone that can lift a heavy weight. But we didn't even risk testing it at the training ground to see how it could work. Even though I wanted to ride it so that it could lift me. However, we realized that it was such a controversial device that it was better not to try.
- What do you like most about your job?
- As in any job, it's the result. It's great to have not just some abstract KPIs, but to see that an assault has been repelled, equipment has been blown up, or provisions or ammunition load has been delivered to a position. It's great to see the crew you trained quickly kick into gear and start working efficiently.
- Think back to your most successful job. Did you ever experience such a state of euphoria after completing a task?
- To be honest, I don't feel euphoric about my work. It's just a task that needs to be done. I don't even remember any wow effect. It's great when you've fired on enemy artillery, and you realize that it's less nightmarize your front line by 40 percent. You realize that you have done something quite important. Similarly, when the pilots stop an enemy infantry assault and the enemy sees that a large strike bomber is actively firing at them, they are much less likely to advance and jump into our trenches. This is also nice.
- How would you characterize the enemy in general? What is he like?
- Persistent, if we are talking about the experience of assaults on our line. I do not always fully understand their task. They are in a state of "zerg rush" - they realize that they have little chance, but they just push their way through, in waves. The enemy must not be underestimated. You need to want to destroy it, but you also need to be clear-eyed. This is a strong enemy who also wants to live, like any combatant, so they learn very quickly.
- What kind of pilots do they have?
- They have good pilots. In addition, they have a lot of money. Let's be honest - more than we have. That's why they have air superiority in most areas. Unfortunately, they are working well. We need to constantly assess the situation and learn.
- What's the situation with the EWs? My pilot friends say that their number has increased significantly recently.
- Undoubtedly, it has. After all, the number of drones, both FPV and bombers, as well as "scouts" on both sides, has increased. Accordingly, both we and the enemy have to think about countermeasures. I'm not talking about stationary electronic warfare - large Russian-made machines such as the Borysoglebsk - but about smaller variations of the trench electronic warfare type.
- Are EWs installed on vehicles? On the same infantry vehicles?
- Armored vehicles and logistics vehicles definitely use EWs. I can't say about passenger cars - I haven't researched this much. Speaking of ours, it is no longer possible to drive even ten kilometers to the battle contact line without a full set of protection.
- You told us that you dream of hitting the Sontsepok. This is a heavy 220-mm flamethrower system. Do you see them often?
- No, I don't. It is not such a massive weapon. It's very scary in terms of its impact. But there are nuances with the range - it is too noticeable. That's why the enemy often doesn't use it, like tanks and artillery. However, I have seen it working - both in our direction and in the neighborhood units where I went to work. Unfortunately, not often enough to have time to fly out and hit.
- You are now in Donbas, where the situation is very difficult. Some of the military who are also fighting there say that the strategic goal for the Russian armed forces this year is to reach the administrative border of Donetsk and Luhansk regions. What do you think?
- When they realized that they would not capture Kyiv in three days, they methodically moved to the point where they needed some kind of victory. To conditionally reach the borders of Donetsk and Luhansk regions to say: "We have succeeded!" Given the way, the enemy is now breaking through in the Pokrovsk direction and what is happening here (since April, there have been constant assaults), this absolutely coincides with the thoughts you have voiced - they are trying to completely occupy these two regions.
- At the same time, we are told about the victory plan that the president recently presented to America. Zelensky expressed hope that the war would end no later than 2025. In general, there is often talk of victory next year. Given what you see, how do you feel about this?
- If we talk about the entire length of the front line today, we are not advancing anywhere. We are just ride it out. On what basis should the situation become a turning point for the war to end? There is an option, but it's not one that we all like. I think such talk is another episode of failed communication in the style of "the war will end in two or three weeks." And this is very bad, both for the military and for the civilian population, who will be waiting for the war to end in 2025.
- By the way, among the civilian population, one can increasingly see the mood of war fatigue. It was the case during the ATO and JFO, but now we are talking about a full-scale war. Moreover, we realize that the enemy still wants to destroy us. It seems to me that this should be constantly emphasized so that people do not forget about it...
- The failed rhetoric of victory greatly increases the split between the military and civilians. Because there are no prerequisites for demobilization. We are here, working. Civilians are told that the war will end in two or three weeks, or next year, instead of preparing people for the opposite - it will not end in such a time frame, mobilization will also continue, no matter how controversial and unsuccessful it is. Many people will have to support the army, if not join it, as long as it holds back the enemy, and learn, if not a military specialty, then at least a tactical one. There must be an understanding that we are at war. Accordingly, we must live in it. Because it no longer concerns only a certain part of the population, but everyone! The enemy is killing civilians in cities across the country every day. In such circumstances, we cannot talk about ending the war, because it causes disorientation of society.
- Sometimes you get the feeling that many civilians remember the war when an air raid alert sounds or a shelling takes place. The rest of the time they don't. It can be a trap, right?
- It can become a trap. Now the enemy is not only fighting on the battlefield but also bombing and destroying civilian cities. You have to be very abstracted not to see that the war is all over the country. The enemy is no longer trying to storm Kyiv like in 2022, but missiles and shaheds are still flying in. It's hard for me to imagine how you can pretend that it doesn't affect you. I work in a slightly different context.
- What motivates you to stay at the front today?
- I can't say it's about motivation. It's about a sense of duty and responsibility.
- From your interviews, I got the impression that you don't like to talk about gender issues in the army...
- Indeed. I think there are many people who do a better job of covering gender issues in the army. I am not an expert in gender studies.
- There is an important nuance: you are a commander. A woman in such a position is a rarity. Do you have your own recipes for working with personnel? Even male commanders admit to me that it's not always easy.
- It's like with children: you can read a lot of books on pedagogy, but a child will still imitate the behavior of his parents. It's the same with a commander: he cannot have his own recipe. He has to set an example. I cannot demand from my soldier something that I cannot do myself. My task is to teach a person on the basis of my combat experience, to explain what works and how, and then he goes on with it.
- I'll quote you about men who went abroad: "The main thing is not to come back." Do you think they plan to do that?
- I am least concerned about the plans of men who have left for Austria, Belgium or Romania. I am most interested in the people who are next to me, so that they are provided with everything they need to do their job. My task is to protect them as much as possible. As for the people you mentioned, what they did is on their conscience.
- We have one more painful issue - the AWOL. The court sent to custody a soldier, Serhii Hnezdilov, who went AWOL and publicly announced it. How did you take this story?
- I don't know what the person really intended. It's a betrayal and a violation of the law! How can you do something bad and say it's for a good cause, to attract attention? In fact, this is the abandonment of the post.
- But there are also non-public cases of AWOL...
- Of course, there are cases of AWOL. But I cannot condemn the same infantryman who sat in the position for three months under everything that could possibly fire and had a nervous breakdown. He went through hell on earth. He lost his nerves and ran away. To prevent this from happening, people need to be changed. No one is a robot! There are no cyborgs or creatures made of titanium here. Everyone is an ordinary flesh-and-blood person. A soldier needs to be given time to rest. It is trivial to change him for a week or two, so that he can take a short rest. If we had enough people, the situation would be different.
- When deputies adopted the law on mobilization, they removed the provision on demobilization, promising to consider this issue separately, but this has not happened yet, and the prospects are vague. How do you feel about this?
- These promises are populism. For a long time, our mobilization policy failed, when people were recruited through the TCR and SS and randomly assigned to units. This is now being handled differently - most brigades have taken over recruiting and are recruiting people directly, which is changing the situation dramatically. This can be a good story in the future, which will bring consequences when a person comes and chooses a profession. We also have to realize that we cannot win the war with people with drawn swords. We need to rely on technology as much as possible. We cannot hold out with infantry. In general, we need to realize that these are the people who have the hardest time. This is really the most difficult job in the world. Let's take a specific case - to take an enemy position. Don't send a mopping-up team there! Give me the opportunity to knock out all the manpower with drones. Then let our people enter and consolidate their positions. But it doesn't work that way so often.
- There are also still discussions about lowering the mobilization age. What do you think about this?
- I can't say that I am in favor of conscription at the age of 18. But sooner or later, we will have to address this issue to man the army. I can tell you from my experience - now I have a boy who is 21 or 22 years old who has come to me voluntarily. He is a cool adult and a conscious person who does his job well. There are no children at war. When people say: "Child, where did you go?" is disrespectful. This is a warrior. He made a decision that people twice his age who fled are not capable of. He showed courage and came here. Therefore, these are not children, but warriors!
Olha Moskaliuk, Censor.NET
Photo courtesy of Leila
