If Ukraine loses, occupiers will throw entire male population to "meat assault" on Europe - Bohdan Kovalenko, soldier of 126th Brigade of Territorial Defense Forces

Author: Anna Miroshnychenko, "Who is with Miroshnychenko?"

Bohdan Kovalenko spoke about God, Ukrainians, the Russian language, Russians, Putin and tactical medicine in an exclusive interview with Anna Miroshnychenko. The 30-year-old fighter of the 126th Brigade of the Territorial Defense Forces (TDF) received the Cross of Military Merit from the President. He told about how he became a victim of propaganda in Odesa in 2014 and what all Ukrainians should do today.

WHO IS BOHDAN KOVALENKO?

- My name is Bohdan, I am 30 years old. I'm from Odesa, I serve in the 126th TDF Brigade, 120th Battalion, reconnaissance platoon. Over the summer, my comrade and I received awards for our work on the islands, but he received them a little earlier, and I received them later. "The Cross of Military Merit. First of all, it is a responsibility for the received award, because you understand that people, my command, appreciated my work, which imposes even more responsibility for further actions.

My last task was to reach Krynky. My group was tasked to reach Krynky, let's not go into details about my task. When entering Krynky, when landing, there was a drop of F-1 grenade from the drone and I was wounded. All safely, I was able to help myself and pull back to a safe area where my comrades were. Our brigade tried, my battalion tried to evacuate me back, but it's very difficult - because of the water barrier and a very long stretch. Anything can happen during this long stretch. I had no other way out, I still stayed with the guys, I was 4 days.

ABOUT THE SPECIAL OPERATION

-With injuries?

-Yes, yes. When it is gray, the military will understand me, it is when there is an interval - the sun sets and rises, this interval when it is more or less light, not too dark, when you can see where and what, I was helped and I stayed there for four days until my next evacuation. A lot was going on there during those four days. A challenging direction just like for the Marine Corps, for us, 126 Brigade, a very challenging direction. Why? Because the logistics are very, very complicated. Everything that goes there can only be transferred by water. Everything. By water. The enemy controls the entrances, the exits. FPV drones help us a lot, because if it wasn't for them, it would be a lot worse. We then the whole group, thank God, came out, only one I was three hundredths, you can say that an angel kissed me because when I was lying just before the evacuation, then it was, to put it mildly - not to say - not comfortable and their assaults were from different sides on Krynky and it was scary, because you are not lying in some fortified basement, bunker. You're lying in an ordinary building, two hits - and this building collapses. You're lying there, you see this building, which is all shattered, collapsed partially. You huddle yourself up in a corner, you're cold, you're constantly wet, things can't dry, you can't get warm. You can't move either, because the enemy drones work the same way, nobody cancels FPV either. You're lying on bare concrete, there's nothing you can do in this situation, as my instructor used to say - lucky or unlucky.

ABOUT GOD

- What do you think luck depends on? 

-For some people, it is luck, who is a believer, believes in God, and believes that God helps. I won't say that I believe in God, I believe that there is something above us, I believe in all of this, I don't quite agree with what the church says, but there is something above us that helps us. My opinion is that you don't have to go to church to talk to God, you can talk in absolutely any place where you feel comfortable. He will hear you everywhere. 

- Do you pray before tasks?

-Yes, in our heads, we don't make it into some ritual, that we became in front of some icon - no. Everyone psyches himself up in his head in his own way. The scariest thing is to see how you once coached guys in the beginning, and the scariest thing for me is to see when they die. You realize that there are people who had 5 children, 4 children and a man still went to perform, so to say, a man's duty, and they die. I feel sorry for the guys, I feel sorry for the men. We all understand what we are doing, we all understand that there is a risk of not coming back from there, but it is frustrating because a man could have done many good things, but unfortunately, he will never do it again. What he could do in this life, he did, everything that depended on him he did. Unfortunately, not all the guys come back from there. That's the scariest thing for me, everything else... there's nothing to be super afraid of. It's scary to die and so on, everything is absolutely scary - I'm scared, my comrades in arms are scared, everyone who fights, guys, men, old men, who fight, we are all human beings. We are not made of something else, we have the same blood, we may be in pain, but fear is such a thing - you either give in or work with it - there is a saying. All things are difficult before they are easy. And from the other side, the enemy is just as scared, they are not robots, they are not supermen or beasts, they are the same people, they are just as scared, they don't want to die, only we are fighting for our home. They come from nowhere, they don't know why and for what. Someone for money, someone pursues their own reasons, they will leave - they will be fine there, and if we leave, go away, force off, push back because I am scared, I will not go - tomorrow it will be at your home, in your city.

- I feel that now there is such a resentment towards those who are not involved in the war, not involved, not training as you ask.

- It's not that I'm resentful, but I don't understand. A misunderstanding - why, while you have time, why don't you prepare? You can't hunker in a bunker, wait it out. Maybe some percent will, but it will be a very, very small minority, that's one point. The second point is that people do not understand what you are not doing now, you are shifting the responsibility for your actions to your children and grandchildren. Why? Because it may not end now, let's say, in 10 years it will continue, 10 years it will go on, 20 years it will go on, 100 years it will go on, and your children, your grandchildren will be at war, if you do not go now and finish it all. The beginning, so to speak, of the war, now it is a full-scale war, then it was, as they say, local, but it is still a war. Those who did not fight in 2014, children were 10 years old, 10 years later today someone's child is fighting, although then it could have been finished. Could it have been? I think it could have.

ABOUT PROMOTION

- You didn't join in 2014 either, did you?

- Yes, but I was 18 or 19 years old at the time. I honestly berated myself for it. 

- Because you didn't join in 2014, did you?

- Because I didn't join, I fell for the propaganda at the time, I'm speaking frankly. What we had on television, I fell for it all and I can say about it without a twist of heart. I was absolutely loyal to some things until the 24th of the year 2022. Then that was it.

- What changed in your mind on 24 February?

- I saw who these people are and what they do. I can't even articulate, for me they are not human beings. What they did there, to me, is neither honor nor dignity. You're not warriors. A real warrior has honor, dignity, understanding of this or that, and when you allow yourself to do such things... Anyone can offend a weak person, anyone can offend a woman or a child, you don't have to be a super fighter or a superwarrior, you just have to be... I won't say it.

ABOUT THE LANGUAGE

- You speak Russian...

-Yes, I speak more Russian

- Of course, it's impossible to ban it, especially for you, a military man, but I'm sure that people will write in the comments - how? Why does he speak Russian? Are you learning the language?

-Yes.

- I hear Ukrainian words from you, so you are trying, aren`t you?

- I speak Ukrainian quite well, but I don't have enough practice in terms of conversational skills, so it's a little difficult for me to formulate my sentences quickly in order to answer certain questions quickly. I will immediately respond to these comments - my opinion is that it does not matter what language a person speaks, what matters is what he thinks and what he does to make things better in our country, in Ukraine. The fact that people speak Ukrainian and at the same time do a lot of bad things for our country, for our people, it does not make them better, it does not make them better as Ukrainians or patriots. It is good that a person speaks Ukrainian, but it is actions that matter more than words. 

ABOUT RUSSIANS

- Who do you think we are at war with now?

- Everyone should realize that the enemy is learning, the enemy is no longer as relaxed as they were initially, when they thought they would parade here, everything would be fine, and they would be greeted with bread and salt and the tricolor. When they started getting their fill of it, they began to realize. The enemy also learns, and in war, it can't be otherwise. Everyone laughed at the Chmobiks (Chmobiki are Russian citizens who were mobilized as a result of partial mobilization in Russia in September 2022 - ed. note), and for nothing. Today he is a Chmobik, even the most ordinary Russian who knows absolutely nothing, in a year he will already know how to do it, and a full-scale war lasts two years. During these two years, a person will already know how to do something, 100 percent, because if you want to survive, you have to learn. There is no such thing that you will work half-heartedly. If you work half-heartedly, you won't work long. They have a big country, they have a professional army, a lot of professional people who fight well. Take Wagner, which doesn't exist now, but still. These are people who know how to fight - you can't take that away. You have to respect the enemy. When I was training people, I used to say: prepare as if you were going to fight against their best unit. Then you'll train with full force. And when people are told that they are all fools, chmobiks, that they don't know how to do anything - you will not take it seriously, you will think that they are all so stupid, and I will come and do everything quickly. And then you meet reality.

ABOUT THE FUTURE

- What is Putin's ultimate goal and what are his plans for NATO countries, do you think? We talk about this a lot this year, how do you see it?

- I think that these plans are not a secret to anyone, what he says is that he is not going to attack Poland, the Czech Republic, Europe. Look at old interviews where he said that he would never attack Ukraine, that he was interested in the integrity of Ukraine, that there would never be wars between our countries. We all see what is happening today. The same thing now he is saying - I never intended, I am not going to attack Europe and so on, we all realize that this is a lie. They openly say that we are their mobilization resource, they, God forbid, we will do everything to prevent this from happening. If Ukraine loses, the entire male population, especially those who are not fighting now, if they think that somehow it will not affect them - it will. Only you will no longer be asked whether you want to or not. You will no longer take pictures on your phone and shout that the TCR (Territorial Centre for Recruitment) employees are bad, the state is bad and makes me go to war. If you have acquaintances in Donetsk or Luhansk - ask them how it was. They won't ask you. And you will "collegiate" go in the first ranks to "meat assaults" in Europe - in Poland first, in the Czech Republic - it's just a matter of time. It's not going to happen just like that, at the click of a button, it's a matter of time. If, God forbid, it happens, Ukraine will lose and it will happen in 10-15, or maybe 5 years, but it will happen.

HOW LONG THE WAR WILL LAST

- How can we win, Bohdan, in such conditions? Do you assume that you can still fight, you are 30 now, but can you fight for the next five years?

- Yeah. I was watching a Yankee interview (Igor Yankov, call sign Yankee, Belarusian oppositionist, volunteer fighting for Ukraine - ed. note) once and I loved what he said when he was asked the question - "how long do you prepare for, do you expect, how long will you be at war. And he said 300 years, get ready to fight 300 years." Imagine, all the people believed that the war would be 100 years. Would you be upset if it ended a year from now with our victory? And I will not be upset; no one in Ukraine will be upset. As long as it is necessary - as long as they will be. In one way or another, but I will be involved. It's not always to be an ordinary infantryman or a scout. There are a lot of areas for IT guys, not everyone is going to be an assaultmen or a scout. You can be a cool drone guy on mavics, FPV, now there's going to be a development in our industry about drones - water, land, air and so on. Some guys do drone work directly, they do tremendous work like in assaults, repelling assaults and so on. And all the people somehow think that now he will come, he will be given a machine gun without training and sent to Bakhmut or Kupiansk to assault something. No, this will not happen either, they will be prepared in any way, but you have time to prepare now - medicine, firearms training. There are a lot of courses now, just go to the Internet and look - a variety of courses, with different instructors, with military or non-military. Okay still firearms, not everyone has the opportunity, it's not exactly cheap. To study medicine, you don't need a lot of money, just take a course in Tactical Combat Casualty Care, the most basic. You live in a time when at any moment something can strike somewhere nearby and you will have a first aid kit with you and you will be able to save a person's life. I've always had this opinion - it's better to know how to do something and you don't need it than to have a situation come up and you don't know how to do it, especially medicine. It saves a lot of lives both in the military and here.

ABOUT THE UKRAINIAN MILITARY

- What do you think, Bohdan, is the level of respect for the military in Ukraine today? Respect for guys your age, 30 years old, what do you think?

-The respect for the military is good enough, but we must realize that not all military men are an example to others. Not all military men are an example, if he wears a military uniform and fights somewhere, he is an example - no. A military man must be a military man to the end, that is, if you come here as a civilian, you must behave like that and understand that for every action you take, you go out somewhere, you behave wrongly, alcohol and so on, in uniform, you must understand that you will be judged later on by all the military and the unit. Because I have met this many times - when I was hospitalized in Odessa and I literally live not far from this hospital and when I arrived, I just wanted to go and have a bath, I went to the doctor and asked him to let me go 20 minutes away from this hospital, he let me go, but it was very, very difficult to let me go. Why? Because before us there were military men, who, I don't know what to call them, who should be caught, closed, because he will be addicted to something and then something can happen to him. I am also a human being, I can rest somewhere, but I do it in my сompany, where no one sees, no one knows, I rested and went to sleep. When I am in uniform when I am in society, I behave as much as possible so that all my unit would judge me and realize that there are great guys there, there guys are working on themselves, helping the country, each other, helping everyone else, the society. If I had time, here, in civilian life, I would also help those who are interested in firearms training and weapons handling. It is interesting for me not only to collect this knowledge but also to impart it on because it will come in handy. Girl, boy, it will come in handy. Woman, man, it will come in handy, because you never know what can happen, and to be able to handle weapons is a necessary skill in any case, it will come in handy absolutely everywhere. If it wasn't for the war, I would have been doing what I was doing before the full-scale invasion - I was working in private security and had business ideas with a friend, but the full-scale invasion made its adjustments. My dream is to have my own family, to develop myself as a person in different directions, to travel around the world, not only in Ukraine, I have traveled a lot, I like it, in the driver's seat or just to go to a new place, to walk, to meet new people, to communicate, to pass on some knowledge, to learn something new for myself, to tell people something new, in this direction. 

-We should make a YouTube channel so that you can make videos and share them with the world...

-I'm not really a public person

-This is, by the way, Bohdan's first interview

-Yes, I like live communication better. If we gather people, it's live communication, where I can see the result, when a person is working, you show them and see how quickly they absorb. People are absolutely different, someone absorbs very quickly, someone needs a little more attention. I also realized this in my instructor practice - it is very easy to teach a capable person, but when you see that a person does not succeed and he is not quite capable and when he starts to succeed in something, to handle the weapon after a couple of hours, he looks bright-eyed and bushy-tailed. You can see how a person's eyes start to fizz, he realizes that he just needs to put more effort into it. It's too bad that people give up when things don't work out. You can be good at one thing, when you are very good at it, you feel it from the first day, and something else will not quite work out well. I can be the opposite, but it's all about effort. Let's go back to the saying - all things are difficult before they are easy. Work, work and only work. There is no other way, also in military affairs, directions that I do not know, I work through, i am given a bit of a clue, read books, watch YouTube, learn something new and constantly teaching. To be in the trend, you have to be constantly interested in what's going on and where it's going on and learn from it. I would like that people, absolutely everyone, we are not talking only about the military or civilians, absolutely everyone would be more united among themselves, able to empathize, stop being selfish, thinking only about themselves. Let's take Ukraine - if we think for each other, not only for our own well-being and health, you will not notice how absolutely everyone, including me, you, everyone around you, will find it easier to live, when everyone will help a little bit, a little bit at a time. The same donations. It is not necessary to donate millions, thousands, it is enough for everyone to gather, get together, Ukraine and donate 10 hryvnias. You understand - how it will be, how much it will be. And you lost only 10 hryvnias. I do not understand a little when people, I do not consider myself the smartest, that I have reached, and someone can not, you just have to think about it. Think about how I can help, and you can help in different ways, not necessarily financially, you can always help with something. There are people who sew nets, collect something for the guys, goodies, you know, in any case it will be pleasant, it may seem to you that it is something insignificant, but there is absolutely nothing insignificant in life because the whole picture is built from little things.

- I really hope that you will be heard. The energy is fierce. I thank you very much for being with us, for what you are doing for Ukraine, for teaching and learning yourself. We really need such fighters. Thank you very much.

Anna Miroshnychenko, "Who is with Miroshnychenko?"